Red Light Camera News
COPS COMPLAIN ABOUT STOP LINE SCAM!
http://www.southtownstar.com/news/kadner/2094183,031010kadner.article
March 10, 2010
BY PHIL KADNER
Cross the line. I dare you! That old schoolyard challenge has taken on a new meaning for motorists.
Stop your car past the white line before making a right turn on red and you could be in real trouble.
Several former police officers, each with more than 20 years on the job, have contacted me in recent weeks to complain about red light cameras. More specifically, their complaint is about the municipal administrative hearings that make final rulings in such cases.
"I never, in 25 years on the job, wrote a ticket to someone who came to a stop at a red light," one former officer told me. "Now I get a ticket because I came to a stop, but it was past the white line. That's chicken ..."
I recently visited a red light camera hearing in Country Club Hills to see what was happening for myself.
About a dozen motorists who had been issued tickets were waiting for their moment in court, which is located in the city council chambers. An attorney trained as an administrative judge presided on this day, although Mayor Dwight Welch told me that until recently he had been using former police chiefs as hearing officers.
"I thought they knew the law regarding traffic violations better than anyone but found out that we're supposed to have attorneys acting as administrative judges, so that's what we did," Welch told me.
Attorney Judy Kolman introduced herself as the hearing officer on the night I visited Country Club Hills. She explained to all that the fine for failing to stop at a red light was $100. If found guilty in the hearing, the conviction would not go on the driving records of motorists.
If they chose to appeal the verdict to a Cook County Circuit Court judge in Markham, however, the fine would rise to $254 if they were found guilty and the result would go on their driving records, possibly affecting their insurance premiums.
Anticipating what was to come, Kolman clearly explained before the first offender stepped forward that any failure to stop at the white line while making a right turn on red was a violation of the traffic code. She told everyone they should've learned that while taking their driver's license exam.
On a large flat-screen TV mounted on a wall a recording is played, and replayed, of each car that was ticketed.
One by one the offenders come forward.
Kolman comes around the council chambers to view the recordings at the same angle as the person cited for the traffic violation. Angles matter.
From where I sit, it looks as if almost every motorist failed to come to a stop at all. The red light on the traffic signal is clearly visible.
"Guilty," Kolman states time and again, in a flat but firm tone of voice. "You made the stop after the white line."
One older fellow, who I had met prior to the hearing, said he had entered the intersection while the light was yellow.
"No doubt about it," he said. "I'm here because they gave me a ticket for going through a yellow light.'
His jaw is set, his eyes glare with indignation, and he can't wait to appear before the judge.
The recording is played. His car never stops at all as he makes the right turn. The light is red. Not only is it red as he turns, it was red before his car even got to the corner.
"Guilty," Kolman barks.
As the fellow leaves the room, I whisper, "What happened?"
"Guess I was wrong," he replied with a shrug of the shoulders.
In two cases, Kolman rules "not guilty."
"You stopped on the line," Kolman explained. "I'm not going to penalize you for that, but technically that's a violation."
While reviewing another recording, Kolman spots a car that has not been ticketed.
"That's what I'm talking about," Kolman shouts. "That car stops behind the white line. That's a perfect illustration of what you are supposed to do.
"Now, if your view is obstructed looking left, you can edge forward after making your stop. That's acceptable. But you have to make your stop behind the white line before you edge forward."
Welch had told me last year that his city would not be issuing tickets to cars that stopped, white line or no white line.
"It's come to my attention that we have recently changed that policy," Welch said. "But our people review every recording before a ticket is issued, and I'm going to tell them if a car stops before making a turn, we don't issue a ticket. Technically, however, that is a violation."
I told Kolman that I was surprised I haven't gotten a ticket because I pass the white line all the time before stopping.
"I've been waiting to get a ticket myself," she laughed. "I do it, too."
I am now very conscious of where I stop. Still, half the time, I stop past the white line.
C
http://www.southtownstar.com/news/kadner/2094183,031010kadner.article
crossing the line on red light cameras
written by ali , January 09, 2012
read the compiled statues it says the city can not ticket you even if you pass the cross walk or line UNLESS there is a pedestrian or bicyclist at the cross walk. if u pass that line and cross walk they can not ticket you unless there is at a minimal one person there...
written by t , June 10, 2011
Thanks for the ticket that I cant pay. License will probaly get suspended I cant find a job, take my son to school, and be productive. People wonder why we resort to crminal activity. Thanks in advance for the actions cch have forced me to take
written by COUNTRY CLUB HILLS SUCKS!!! , August 11, 2010
ANOTHER BROKE ASS SUBURB SCAMMING THE TAX PAYING AMERICANS MONEY FUCK YOU WELCH AND YOUR SHITTY SUBURB ISN"T HIGH PROPERTY TAXES ENOUGH YOU FUCKING LEECHES HOPE YOUR THE NEXT FORD HEIGHTS OR ROBBINS ONE MORE TIME FUCK YOU!!!!!!
written by Ron , August 04, 2010
What ever happened to 'right turn on red, use caution?' I began a right turn when the light was yellow, but during my scan of the intersection for traffic or pedestrians, the yellow timed out. I didn't see the light change because I was focused on the road. Traveling feet per second I was already committed to the turn, and of course now I 'ran a red light' and was found guilty during the hearing.
The law has been subverted into a game of gotcha', administered without common sense or good judgement. I have no problem with red light cameras being used to penalize those whom 'blow' through an intersection when the light is red. I don't like the idea of being 't-boned.' But it seems that the majority of fines are for relatively insignificant 'right turn on red ' infractions.
As it stands, this is a bad interpretation of a good idea. The only clear rationale is one of entrapment to extort money while masquerading as a public safety issue. Now (North) Miami is like driving through rural Central America. That's where federales with crossed bandeleros of ammunition on their chests set up roadblocks every few miles, and take your money based on some supposed infraction.
The local news just detailed how on and off duty police officers, school bus drivers, county and municipal vehicles, and even public officials are being ticketed under this draconian right turn on red law.
This unjust victimization cannot continue. Either re-write the right turn on red law to allow for a more contemporary interpretation, or 'ban the cams.' Until then, I'm stopping behind the line even if the light just turned yellow. I will further wait until the light turns red, and then count one thousand one, one thousand two, and only then turn right on red if the situation allows.
written by Gaffi , July 02, 2010
Thanks for the support!
I do agree with you on the increased rear-end incidence, actually. Around here, we have the red-light cameras and we have speeding cameras. Whenever I go past the few I do on a regular basis, the traffic always slows from 50-60 (posted 50) to sometimes as slow as 35! I frequently have to apply the brake when approaching.
I haven't noticed as much at the red-light cameras, but those tend to be easier to avoid for me.
written by Henry , June 26, 2010
Gaffi, Good stuff on your blog. First good luck with your battle. Second I am sure during you research on the issue you have changed your mind about what you thought the pros to electronic law enforcement are. I'm am referring to "
1. Reduces number of traffic related injuries/deaths, due to a lower incidence of traffic safety violations."
I have seen many studies so that intersections where the cameras are installed that rear end accidents are on the rise. These accidents are also more costly and tend to cause more injury's than a side impact crash.
http://banthecams.org/20100622276/Washington-Times-EDITORIAL-Rebooting-the-red-light-camera-cash-grab.html
http://banthecams.org/20100525224/WEST-PALM-RLC-CAUSE-MORE-WRECKS.html
http://banthecams.org/2010032498/Louisiana-RLC-FAIL-to-reduce-accidents.html
http://banthecams.org/2010030863/Link-to-studies-showing-RLC-DON-T-WORK.html
http://banthecams.org/DID-YOU-KNOW.html
again good luck
written by Gaffi , June 25, 2010
I got a ticket for a similar 'offense' (haven't been properly served yet, however). In Arizona, you CAN stop behind the white line, but I didn't learn that until after I got my photo in the mail. More info at my blog about it here: http://gaffi-rantomness.blogsp...el/Driving
I'll be updating as things progress...
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